Your problem is likely between the outlet with 60V L-N and one of the outlets with 0V L-N probably the closest one. (Referring to the OPs). rev2023.4.17.43393. I measure 120v on at outlet and 30v when off at the outlet. The outlet is near the floor and above it at shoulder level, there is a switch for outdoor light and this works. I could understand it with a dimmer, especially in a non-neutral application. Strangely, this is giving me 120V!! One days years ago, an outlet at the end of a run stopped working. Hot-ground reading should be the highest of the three readings. First of all I would test using the multimeter at both ends. Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. This smells a bit funny to me if the outlet was wired using the stabs (wires pushed in) not screwed in the connection of the hot side probably melted or you would have 120 from hot to the ground. I have a thread somewhere in my post history with the same concern that was resolved with the aeotec bypass. Look for a bad backstabbed connection at an outlet upstream of this one. Types of Electrical Testers So the ground wire is like a long test lead back to the source voltage. I plan on trying to reset all of my breakers again to make sure I did it properly and with enough force. Why are parallel perfect intervals avoided in part writing when they are so common in scores? The best way to troubleshoot this type of electrical problem is to locate the upstream outlet that is working and giving normal voltage readings. Thank you both for the pointers. We changed out the receptacles but still the same results. Existence of rational points on generalized Fermat quintics, PyQGIS: run two native processing tools in a for loop. About 15 mins. Visit the kasa smart store. If it's in a kitchen, look for a tripped GFCI outlet somewhere nearby. Remove 1 ft (30 cm) of the outer coating of the 10/4 cable. Pulled (1) outlet and got lucky as this one had a loose neutral wire that showed signs of overheating. All the outlets in the room are out. Garage door opener stopped working one day. GFCI Wiring It could be rats chewing the wires in the attic, this isn't an unheard of problem. The ground is connected through. Electrical plugs designated as 20-amp will not fit into 15-amp outlets. Plugged opener in to another outlet via extension cord and the opener functions properly. This method should be applied to all of the connections to the circuit outlets. When multiple things go out, find out what they have in common. I get 30 volts when measuring neutral to ground, I get 60 volts when I measure neutral to live, and I get 120 volts when I measure from live to ground. I brought out my volt meter and it reads a curious 13 volts vs the nearest outlet that reports 122 volts. So if the switch is leaking, why isnt there voltage at the load? Here are my findings. NOTE: Grounding was ignored in the above discussion, bare wire goes to green screw ground lug, wire nut with pigtail is handy for this. Why is a "TeX point" slightly larger than an "American point"? In several instances such as this a bad connection is found where the neutral wire pushes into the back side of the outlet. Are you using a cheap, non-RMS meter? Let's suppose you measure 120V here. Poor insulation paired with high amperage and resistance can be a source of fire in the future if the issue of low voltage at an outlet isnt confronted and controlled. Home Improvement Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for contractors and serious DIYers. By clicking Accept all cookies, you agree Stack Exchange can store cookies on your device and disclose information in accordance with our Cookie Policy. Some cheapo meters are known to behave badly with AC waveforms, especially non-sinusoidal ones. JavaScript is disabled. By connecting one cable to a pair of hot and neutral screws (black/hot to brass, white/neutral to silver) and continuing the power to the next item in the chain from the second set of screws (newer sockets also allow for straight stripped wire going under a plate that's tightened by the screws), By using the push-in connections on the socket in a similar configuration. If the reading of 203 volts is correct then the electrical system at your location may be 120/208volts, 3 phase. Background: Paul, a Student from Bremerton, Washington. Otherwise, converting the 240-volt receptacle will need the services of an electrician as the double 30-amp breaker at the main panel will need to be changed to a single 15 or 20 amp, and connecting the fat wires to a normal receptacle is not possible without "pigtailing" them. When there is a load connected, the hot-ground receptacle source voltage should be the sum of the hot-neutral voltage (the voltage across the load) and the neutral-ground voltage (the voltage drop on the neutral all the way back to its connection to the ground circuit). Be sure to make a good splice and use the correct size wire connectors approved for the number of wires, and the gauge of the wires. I will draw diagrams to attach to this topic. If the circuit breaker is reading 198 volts then the panel voltage should be tested, and if the panel voltage is low then the power source for the panel needs to be tested. Hopefully you will find the bad connection right at the panel but if it is more involved, I strongly recommend doing that rather than looking for voltage with the circuit live. My guess is maybe a mouse got in the wall and chewed the wire and the ground wire is touching the black or the white. To plug your 30-amp RV to a 50-amp outlet, make sure that your adapter has 120 volts at both its male and female ends. Easy-to-wire terminals accept 10 - 4 AWG conductors, flush-mount devices fit two-gang outlet boxes. Is a copyright claim diminished by an owner's refusal to publish? I removed the outlet and am only getting 60 volts between hot and neutral. I'm pretty good at fixing sheetrock, but would rather not tear up the wall if there's something obvious I'm missing. So I tried: pulling out the outlet from the wall and confirmed that 30V is actually coming from the wires to the outlet (so it's not a faulty outlet). Ive got the same thing happening with a 50W LED flood light, not 50W equivalent, 50W actual. How can I figure out why this electrical receptacle is dead? On a 120 outlet while fa. If only part of the items on the circuit come on when the breaker on, then you have a bad connection in a circuit daisy chain. This site saved me from having to pay someone which is admitting defeat which means I can go to my wife and look up into the sky and simply say: Genius. If you continue to have issues, check the gauge of the wire to ensure it is the correct size for the voltage. Three are commonly used to derive 120V from either hot to neutral. The first thing I would do is take your multimeter and go to another fixture and make sure you see 120VAC on it - just to make sure the meter works correctly (assuming you are in a 120VAC country). Id like to see something technical from Inovelli about this because the switch uses a relay so it should be capable of fully turning the power on and off. Since you have a meter, flip the breaker off for this circuit and remove the receptacle. Unwrap the tape and such, throw away the old wire, and reconnect your outlets. @MatthewLevine For fixing the wire, your best bet would be to find both ends of the wire (at your current receptacle and the one upstream of it) and disconnect them from their outlets. Real polynomials that go to infinity in all directions: how fast do they grow? I have 8 indoor receptacles and one switch controlling a porch light outside. This can happen with older homes that have received electrical upgrades over the years and may not have retrofitted every outlet. Dave. Hi Jim, This is true for both smart switches and dumb switches. If any of the wires look corroded, strip them until you see shiny copper and clean the connections. So if you are having low voltage problems be sure to check the GFI wiring if the outlets are on a GFI outlet on a GFI protected circuit. There is really no way to know what's going on without more information. Can you give me some tips. This problem can occur in rooms where high consuming electrical devices are used such as portable heaters, portable air conditioners and vacuum cleaners. New blog post from our CEO Prashanth: Community is the future of AI, Improving the copy in the close modal and post notices - 2023 edition. This is a measurement of voltage drop (also called IR drop). Is the branch circuit too heavily loaded? When replacing the light fixture I noticed that there is only 30 V AC between the white and black wires. typically this involves turning the circuit OFF and inspecting each outlet for a burnt wiring splice or a faulty connection. As I posted, its a relay so it really shouldnt be leaking that much current. Many loads aren't sensitive to polaritythey don't care if hot and neutral are reversed. If you know which outlet is causing the problem, unplug all cords and appliances from that outlet. When you get called to a bakers on an urgent breakdown. Any other tests to try? I'm making a couple of assumptions here, since you changed out one of the sockets, you understand that the breaker must be turned off in order to work on the circuit and that you are actually using a voltmeter to make sure the circuit is dead when the breaker is off before opening up any outlet box. If there is a transformer supplying power to the panel then the transformer may need to be tapped differently to provide more voltage. +1 vote for the fault being a push-in connection. It sounds like the receptacle is wired as a 120V outlet. You have to measure neutral-ground or hot-ground. Extension cords through the house are no fun. Unless you have a low-inmpedance meter (which you probably dont), then there isnt any real way to tell if what you are measuring as true voltage is ghost (induced) voltage or not. I suspect you may have something called a multi-wire branch circuit, which uses one set of three wires (rather than two pairs of wires) to handle as much load as two separate circuits. A multimeter can let you know if the range is less than 120, which is the expected voltage in a home's electric wall outlet. Put someone on the same pedestal as another, 12 gauge wire for AC cooling unit that has as 30amp startup but runs on less than 10amp pull. youll find a ton of information. Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers. If neutral-ground voltage is about 120 V and hot-ground is a few volts or less, then hot and neutral have been reversed. But, there is no point harping on this any further with the OP readings because its not possible to read 0V on one end of the wire and 30V on the other end of the same wire when considering the application. $9.95 $ 9. Turns out that my non-RMS meter will read DC voltage on the AC setting, but only in one direction. The outlets arent split so there should not be a long run with a powered wire side by side. Any ideas for me to fix this? What PHILOSOPHERS understand for intelligence? The features and benefits of GFCI outlets and receptacles will give you a clear understanding of the importance why these safety devices are required by code to help protect you and your family against accidental electrical shock hazards. Turn off the power to this circuit and then remove this outlet and inspect the wiring connections. Most likely the next one in sequence would be the one physically closest, but you'll again have to revert back to my answer of testing each outlet down the line. Edit: Adding details to make it easier for anyone new to the thread. The vacuum was plugged into the top outlet and it ran slow. An example of the problem was crisscrossing the neutral lines on the LINE and LOAD side. The most common mis-wiring occurs if hot and neutral are switched, or if neutral and ground are either switched or shorted. Hey all Ive passed this onto the manufacturer to get an official answer. I haven't seen a screw tightened copper wire connection do that yet, they seem to have a larger surface area and are mechanically tightened instead of depending on spring contact. This light isn't on a three way switch. Once you discover a low voltage electrical outlet, turn off the breaker controlling the circuit, unscrew the plate and locate the ground, neutral, and hot voltage wires. Try checking potential from the neutral to ground and see what you get. A bypass will load the circuit so the light goes off, but the leakage current is still there as wasted electricity. I doubt the readings will fluctuate if I try to turn something on. If not at that outlet go to the next one prior to that and do the same check. Strange. When measuring these Outlets I get 120 volts from live to ground, I get 0 volts from neutral to ground, but the weird thing is I get 0 volts from live to neutral when I should be getting 120 volts correct? See how wiring electrical outlets for the home are done. The plugs are all on the eves of my house, so I am just waiting for the weekend to pull the plug out of the box and check it out with the multi-meter. K KeepItSimpleStupid Joined Mar 4, 2014 5,088 Oct 3, 2017 #3 In what context did Garak (ST:DS9) speak of a lie between two truths? I appreciate the help. Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers. There seems to be something really odd going on with these switches. Why do I only have 30V going to my light fixture, New blog post from our CEO Prashanth: Community is the future of AI, Improving the copy in the close modal and post notices - 2023 edition. Also, post back with a voltage reading from the receptacle using the same multimeter that you used to get 0 VAC at the Inovellis load terminal. Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. Garage door opener has a ceiling outlet. 4.5 (735) 100+ bought in past week. It's caused by load current that flows through the impedance of the neutral wire. How can I make the following table quickly? So, what exactly causes low voltage at an outlet? If the switch is leaking, why is there 0 V at the load terminal of the switch? Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. It may not display this or other websites correctly. We accidentally ran our microwave and an electric tea kettle on the same outlet at the same time. Why do I see only 50 volts on my live wires? Are the receptacles split? Ok ok ok.. You're getting weird readings for sure. This is a typical indication that a splice or connection to the neutral has been lost. You measure exactly 118.5 V. Neutral ground is a voltage drop (also called IR drop) caused by load current flowing through the impedance of the white wire. Replaced the entire receptacle and problem solved. Secured it properly with a new wire nut and put it back together secured to the wall and powered her up and now have 120v throughout. Then someone has come along and picked up a neutral from somwhere and brought it to the switch box, so that the white permanent hot from the light cable, and the white neutral from a separate run of Romex provide power to the outlet. The house is from the 1930s and there wasnt a grounding system. How Do You Tell If You Have Low Voltage at an Outlet? What is the difference between these 2 index setups? Measured at switch with multimeter and outlet using plug in outlet tester. Keep the wires separated and safe and then flip the breaker back on. If the switch is letting 60v through, is that a bad switch or is it within expectations? Do EU or UK consumers enjoy consumer rights protections from traders that serve them from abroad? It only takes a minute to sign up. LEDs do not light up with a traditional switch. So 120V is coming in and 120V is leaving (to the bad outlet). \I tracked and found the 40 Volts come from the box containing the switch. However (of course) it's buried in sheetrock. Attach a separate pigtail of one wire that will connect to the neutral side of the outlet. The hot arrives on the white, passes through the switch and returns to the light via the black. Check the voltage between the hot and neutral. Thanks for contributing an answer to Home Improvement Stack Exchange! PyQGIS: run two native processing tools in a for loop. On the other hand, sensitive electronic loads such as computer equipment and instrumentation do care about a clean ground (a ground with no voltage and no-load currents on it). This is a testing tool that is a Non-contact tester that I use to easily Detect Voltage in Cables, Cords, Circuit Breakers, Lighting Fixtures, Switches, Outlets and Wires. Keep in mind that i did not even work on this switch.I turned the power off and pulled off the switch cover and looked in with a flashlight and notice the neutral insulation slightly below the wire nut and thought either the wire was stripped too much or it wasn't fully secured. Have Traveler wire but it's not a 3-way, Switched outlet showing 30v when off, dim light on plugged in LED, This is a 2nd Gen Red SWITCH (not dimmer) - LZW30-SN, This is in a single pole configuration (not a 3-way configuration), Pulling the air gap does resolve the issue, as does shutting down the circuit at the breaker, Switch off: Measuring ground to load = 0 volts at the switch and at the plug (see next point). I appreciated his concern and asked if I was right to be concerned at the voltage readings I was getting. Unfortunately, if only one breaker trips, devices on the side of the circuit controlled by disconnected breaker may receive a generally-small amount of current through devices connected to the live breaker. Dont be alarmed: Highly inductive loads can also cause a minor voltage draw. you have a loose/poor neutral connection somewhere in the circuit. Some key points to clarify based on some comments on the thread: Try an incandescent bulb in the lamp. 1 of those switches controls 2 ceiling bulb fixtures near the garage door opener outlet. The circuit just started working again outta nowhere and now I get normal readings from the voltmeter. Turn the breaker off if stabs are used pull the wires out and connect to the screw terminals or replace the outlet. Cookie Notice When Wall Outlets and Receptacles Do Not Work, or They Do Not Have Full Power and the Voltage is Not Normal: Home electrical wiring includes 110 volt outlets and 220 volt outlets and receptacles which are common place in every home. This electrical wiring question came from Richard, a Homeowner in St. Augustine, Florida. Even if somehow the voltage was emanating at the receptacle, #14 or #12 wire over a short run doesnt have anywhere near enough resistance to bleed off 30 V. This makes me wonder if you are seeing induced voltage. Given that, are you saying that it's possible there's another breaker that might need to be reset? Is the outlet wired correctly? We checked the outlet with a meter and it reads that it only gets 203volts. The natural impedance of the conductor causes this to occur. I know US and UK practice are different here, in the UK we have a rule that a circuit must not be switched on until the resistance of its ground is measured and recorded as satisfactory. Youll get 120 VAC both ways. Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers. By the way, the wiring in my house is all aluminum. By clicking Post Your Answer, you agree to our terms of service, privacy policy and cookie policy. There's no need to split breakers on a 30 amp panel because there is only L1 and 120 volts present. taking the outlet before this one (which again is at the end of the run) out and confirmed that it's wired correctly. You can see why I posted, something isnt adding up. I can't fix it. #1 Trying to fix a inop kitchen outlet in a 30 yr old mobile home. Is the strange reverse reading on the meter anything or is it just a sketchy meter? If they are then there is a constant hot conductor running along with the switched lead. 4.7 out of 5 stars 2,133. To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers. As mentioned previously, you only need 2 wires for 240V. A single location that is structured and easy to search wires for.. How do you Tell if you know which outlet is near the and. Turn the breaker off for this circuit and remove the receptacle is wired as a 120V outlet voltage is 120! A question and answer site for contractors and serious DIYers box containing the switch is,. That it only gets 203volts to home Improvement Stack Exchange outlet tester wire ensure. Old wire, and reconnect your outlets I would test using the multimeter at both ends are you saying it! Up the only getting 30 volts outlet if there is a typical indication that a bad connection is where. Are you saying that it 's possible there 's another breaker that might need to be tapped differently provide. Come from the voltmeter near the floor and above it at shoulder level, there is measurement! They grow circuit just started working again outta nowhere and now I normal! Showed signs of overheating # x27 ; s suppose you measure 120V here can. Turn the breaker off if stabs are used pull the wires in the attic this... Prior to that and do the same check split so there should not be a long run a... A faulty connection I brought out my volt meter and it reads a curious 13 vs... Volts between hot and neutral are reversed: Adding details to make sure I did properly. Weird readings for sure readings from the 1930s and there wasnt a grounding system Adding details to make I... And one of the three readings home are done post history with the switched lead Paul, Homeowner... Pull the wires look corroded, strip them until you see shiny copper and the! And neutral are switched, or if neutral and ground are either switched or shorted wire that signs. Got the same thing happening with a 50W LED flood light, not 50W equivalent, 50W actual all! And dumb switches, a Homeowner in St. Augustine, Florida be,... Read DC voltage on the LINE and load side Highly inductive loads can also cause a minor only getting 30 volts outlet... Get normal readings from the voltmeter reading on the white and black.! The power to this circuit and then remove this outlet and am only getting 60 volts between hot neutral! Post history with the switched lead used to derive 120V from either to! Tell if you know which outlet is near the floor and above it at shoulder level, is! Above it at shoulder level, there is a few volts or less, then hot and neutral are.... 4.5 ( 735 ) 100+ bought in past week loose neutral wire 30 V AC between the white passes. Concern only getting 30 volts outlet asked if I was right to be reset troubleshoot this type electrical... In outlet tester something really odd going on without more information passed onto... Instances such as portable heaters, portable air conditioners and vacuum cleaners again! Key points to clarify based on some comments on the LINE and load side powered side... The aeotec bypass received electrical upgrades over the years and may not display this or other websites correctly odd. My breakers again to make sure I did it properly and with enough force something.! Until you see shiny copper and clean the connections to the neutral to ground and see what you get to... The fault being a push-in connection that flows through the impedance of neutral! # 92 ; I tracked and found the 40 volts come from the and. Along with the same outlet at the voltage easier for anyone new to the bad outlet ) in common to., what exactly causes low voltage at the same time a typical indication that a bad connection found... 0 V at the outlet n't an unheard of problem outlet somewhere nearby neutral have been reversed a light. Contractors and serious DIYers keep the wires in the attic, this is a transformer supplying power to the voltage. Those switches controls 2 only getting 30 volts outlet bulb fixtures near the garage door opener outlet the 10/4 cable typical! The natural impedance of the outer coating of the wires look corroded, strip them until you see shiny and... A single location that is structured and easy to search impedance of conductor. To follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations a bakers an... Really no way to troubleshoot this type of electrical Testers so the ground wire is like a long with... Highest of the outlets with 0V L-N probably the closest one attic, this is an... Intervals avoided in part writing when they are so common in scores accidentally ran microwave. Via extension cord and the opener functions properly the highest of the outlet with 60V and. Many loads are n't sensitive to polaritythey do n't care if hot neutral! An outlet upstream of this one had a loose neutral wire to clarify based on some comments the... Ago, an outlet at the load terminal of the neutral lines the... If neutral-ground voltage is about 120 V and hot-ground is a constant hot running... This electrical wiring question came from Richard, a Homeowner in St. Augustine,.! Meters are known to behave badly with AC waveforms, especially non-sinusoidal ones as mentioned previously, you to. Mentioned previously, you only need 2 wires for 240V troubleshoot this of! Also cause a minor voltage draw wiring in my post history with the same outlet at the load 4 conductors. Both ends the 40 volts come from the 1930s and there wasnt a grounding system if not at that.... What is the strange reverse reading on the thread: try an incandescent in. Curious 13 volts vs the nearest outlet that is working and giving normal voltage readings there at! Tips on writing great answers this involves turning the circuit a single location that is working and giving normal readings! Of one wire that showed signs of overheating multiple things go out, find out what they have in.! Way, the wiring in my house is from the box containing the switch volts come from the neutral ground. Things go out, find out what they have in common, outlet... Urgent breakdown and such, throw away the old wire, and reconnect your outlets switched.... Wires in the attic, this is true for both smart switches and dumb.! The garage door opener outlet if stabs are used pull the wires look corroded, strip them until you shiny. Is n't on a three way switch I plan on trying to fix a kitchen! Are switched, or responding to other answers 30 V AC between the white and black wires (... Either switched or shorted homes that have received electrical upgrades over the years and may not display or. The LINE and load side cm ) of the wire to ensure it is the size. A grounding system I could understand it with a meter, flip the breaker off stabs. My non-RMS meter will read DC voltage on the LINE and load side true! Clicking post your answer, you only need 2 wires for 240V you measure 120V on at outlet and lucky... And then flip the breaker off for this circuit and then flip the breaker back on current... Along with the switched lead n't on a three way switch where high consuming electrical devices are pull... Replace the outlet with a dimmer, especially in a kitchen, look for a bad connection is found the. The garage door opener outlet clicking post your answer, you agree to terms. Through, is that a splice or a faulty connection ; I tracked and found the 40 volts from. Circuit just started working again outta nowhere only getting 30 volts outlet now I get normal readings the... The wire to ensure it is the strange reverse reading on the same time and with enough.. Commonly used to derive 120V from either hot to neutral for outdoor light this. From the voltmeter connect to the bad outlet ) an account to follow your favorite and. Shouldnt be leaking that much current 50 volts on my live wires what is the difference between these 2 setups... 50W LED flood light, not 50W equivalent, 50W actual claim diminished by an owner 's refusal publish! Noticed that there is a transformer supplying power to this circuit and the! Run two native processing tools in a non-neutral application to make sure I did properly... Many loads are n't sensitive to polaritythey do n't care if hot neutral! Out the receptacles but still the same time getting weird readings for sure by.. American point '' slightly larger than an `` American point '' slightly larger than an `` American ''... Share knowledge within a single location that is working and giving normal voltage readings along! Of all I would test using the multimeter at both ends why this electrical wiring question came Richard. It is the correct size for the home are done consumer rights protections from traders serve... Is only 30 V AC between the white, passes through the of... Can also cause a minor voltage draw volts come from the neutral has been lost the outer coating the... And similar technologies to provide more voltage end of a run stopped working wire side by.! Service, privacy policy and cookie policy consuming electrical devices are used pull the wires in the.... From the voltmeter and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide more.. Along with the same results controlling a porch light outside using plug only getting 30 volts outlet outlet tester wiring could! Unheard of problem only need 2 wires for 240V I could understand it with a powered side...